Betty Liu | Founder of Radiate: I think you just ambushed me. Into doing this on Facebook.
Bob Nardelli | Former CEO and Chairman of Chrysler and Home Depot, Founder and CEO of XLR-8: Not I think you did.
Betty: So, for those of you who may or may not know Bob’s immense background: former Home Depot CEO. I think actually when I was working at the Financial Times, I’d interviewed you when you were at Home Depot.
Betty: I believe that’s when we first met.
Bob: First met. Back in 2000.
Betty: So long ago. Also, former Chairman and CEO of Chrysler, and, of course, rose through the ranks at GE to become the CEO of GE Power Systems, and you’re now the founder and CEO of XLR-8, a private equity investment advisory firm.
Betty: OK, great. I’ve got your story background, Bob, and actually that’s kind of where I want to start off for our viewers here, which is, people talk, when they think about their careers, a lot of people these days are saying to themselves, “I’m never gonna retire. I want to work.” Because they see themselves, they see their parents, they say, “I want to continue working “for the rest of my life.” How do you stay fresh? How do you keep that longevity in your career?
Bob: First of all, on working, I’m 68 years old, and I have this goal out there, it’s called QTL: Quality Time Left. So I’m intent on working as long as the good lord lets me. I love it, I think it’s important to stay active. It’s important to stay relevant, and to your question, even today, I listen, I learn, and then I try to lead. So I think it’s very important to immerse yourself in what’s happening today. So, for example, if I was still working off the things I learned in the ’70s, I wouldn’t be relevant. So it’s important to me to be out in the marketplace, to be aware of things that are changing. I mean, technology maybe used to change on the decade; now, it’s changing on the minute, so by no means am I an expert, given this is my first live–
Betty: First Facebook Live. I’m glad we’ve been able to do that for you, Bob.
Bob: I think it’s very important, Betty, that you really stay relevant, that you keep challenging yourself. Again, I kinda live by this motto of an infinite capacity to improve upon everything I do, and then when I was running large organizations, an infinite capacity to provide everything we do. So you kinda set the standard is leading through example.
Betty: So how do you, ’cause I’m always curious, especially with CEOs, ’cause you are bombarded by so many different things, right? You’ve got this fire going on, that fire going on, but then at the same time, you’re required to know what the latest trends are, what the latest technology is, what the latest news is going on. How do you keep that fresh? How do you stay on top of that?
Bob: That’s a great question because I had the luxury and the privilege, when I had large organizations, to have wonderful men and women around me that were a lot smarter than me and challenged me to stay current, so that was a big advantage. Today, when you’re running your own company, you’ve got your own firm, you look around and there’s basically no one there, so you really have to–
Betty: How many people are at XLR-8 right now?
Bob: So, again, it’s very important, so I try to stay current through watching Bloomberg, for example, and in the morning, I’ll watch a couple of TV shows, news. I’ll read a couple of papers. I’m on the business consult, which is a great way to stay current of what’s going on out there. I have four children and three grandchildren, so I learn a lot from them every day. You have to have your antennas up and really be on. We talked earlier about, you’re somewhat of a dry sponge, and you have to immerse yourself in the bucket of technology or what’s happening out there today and come up. Otherwise, you will pace yourself and you’ll pace the businesses that you’re acquiring.
Betty: But do you spend, let’s say an hour a day, or do you try to find a couple of hours a week, or you just sort of sit back and think big things versus you’re on the ground trying to do this deal, trying to buy this company to do this.
Bob: I don’t, I’m not that disciplined, I guess. But I seek every moment. I do 200 nights a year on the road.
Bob: So, I’m in a plane a lot, so I get a lot of–
Betty: How many did you do when you were running, CEO of Home Depot? I mean, is this more or less?
Bob: About the same.
Betty: About the same.
Bob: ‘Cause I would, when I was running Home Depot, we would walk maybe 300 stores a year. We’d go out and touch the associates, touch the customers, touch the product. So, I do get a lot of seat time that allows me to think, to your point, to read. I learned a lot from my mentor, Jack Welch, about connecting the dots, so I’m always looking for, if I read this, how does it relate to that? If I see something happening out there in the market, how can that relate to the businesses that I’ve got in my portfolio, or is there something out there that we should go after and target for potential, both on acquisition and adjacency or something. At Home Depot, we did 50 acquisitions in 18 months, and we went from zero to eight billion in Home Depot supply, and that’s just being sensitive to what’s happening out there.
Betty: Bob, I know you talk a lot, and you write, also, about leadership. So, give me what you think is the biggest leadership issue or hot-button issue going on right now?
Bob: Well, I think there’s a number of them. One we were talking about earlier is this whole area of leadership development, succession planning, performance review. A lot of people out there today, what I find, Betty, they all want authority.
Betty: What do you mean?
Bob: They want to be the boss. They want to be able to approve things. They want to be able to make decisions. So, they want authority. There’s a lesser amount that wants responsibility, and even a lesser amount that want accountability. Is what I see.
Betty: Unless it’s a success, then everyone says, “Me!”
Bob: Well, that’s true, I mean, everybody wants success, or has many parents or many fathers, but it is interesting, in today’s environment, as I see that striation of authority, responsibility, accountability. And, again, I have to admit, I grew up in a culture of accountability. Under Jack, it was make your numbers and you don’t have to talk. Don’t make your numbers, and you can’t talk enough. When we go in for these reviews, if you had a lot of narrative, he would say, “Look, the only number I see in that “is your page number, so let’s flip to the financials.” I’m blessed to have been trained under him about being very granular, getting into the details. You can get criticism for that, and I have in the past, for being too granular, too micro-managing, but if you think about the businesses that I’ve been fortunate to be part of and the organizations, our team has enjoyed tremendous success over the 45 years I’ve been in business.
Betty: How would you describe yourself as a leader? ‘Cause there’s different types, right? There’s the commanding leader. We actually just tweeted out a post about this from a business coach who said there are six types. I can’t remember all of them, but there’s commanding, there’s democratic, there’s coaching.
Bob: I think successful leaders have a piece of all of that. I think if you’re 100% commanding control, you’re not gonna allow for the diversity of your team, and let me tell you what I mean by that. I’m a firm believer that, ’cause I’ve grown up in organizations where they’re always first among peers, and GE was kinda like engineering, and Home Depot tends to be the merchants. So, my philosophy was an equal participation of all the leadership team, literally at a round table. And the way you maximize the sum of the total is that you’re very granular and involved with each individual, and the ability to multi-task through them, so that you have everybody working at the highest level of performance they can by staying involved so you don’t launch and leave. “Betty, go do this, and I’ll see ya in six months.” so you have continual dialogue at the macro/micro level. There’s the strategic view and what are you doing to accomplish it. I think it’s very important, if you can’t put your strategy on one sheet of paper for the organization. At Home Depot, we had 330,000 associates, and so to get clarity, everybody has to know what’s important and how is it what they’re doing everyday contributes to that success. Otherwise, come review–
Betty: Otherwise, they don’t know.
Bob: Well, otherwise, come review time, there’s a disconnect. “I’m working on this;” well, why? “Well, because I thought that’s what you meant.” “No, that’s not what I meant, “I meant about enhancing the core, extending the business, “expanding the market. “Those were the three initiatives.” We had mega-trends back in 2000, post 9/11, the home became a sanctuary. We had aging in place, we had safety and security, so what were the products and services that we were gonna offer consistent with the market back and customer-centric kind of view?
Betty: Bob, I think we’ve got one question from people who are watching, our viewers, so yes, Amy?
Amy: Yep, so Carlos Christen on Facebook asks, “How would you coach an employee “that only wants to do his or her eight hours and go home?”
Betty: That’s a great question.
Bob: Yeah, no, it is a great question, and we’ve dealt with that. We dealt with that type of an issue where, OK, as long as he or she continued to improve every year, and continued to add value because maybe they had children at home, or single parent, they had mothers or fathers that they had to care for, we got it. You need to respect that individuality. Remember I talked about diversity and inclusion? Not only of gender or ethnicity, but of work/life balance. But they also have to understand that that may limit their ability to grow to higher positions within the business, whether it’s public or private. It’s not that they’re bad, it’s just that it limits. When I was running GE Power Systems, it was 24/7. When you’re dealing with Saudi Arabia, they work on Sunday, so they don’t care that Sunday may be off for you, so you better be on your game. Now, Monday’s off there but Monday’s not off in the US, so again, I just think it’s critically important that you’re market focused, customer-centric, and you try to find a way to accommodate good people who have some limitations. I don’t measure people in hours.
Betty: You don’t?
Bob: No, because it may take me 12 hours to do what you could do in two, so I’d like to measure people in accomplishments. People say, “Well, Bob, “if you set a pace of work in 12 hours a day, you force,” no, it just takes me 12 hours. Maybe I just don’t have the skills. But seriously, I think you measure people in accomplishments not so much in time.
Betty: So did you always make sure with the people under you, who reported to you, that they always had very clear goals?
Betty: Because how do you measure that accomplishment? I guess it’s what you were saying which is like, you give them certain directives and then you, at the same time, stay focused.
Bob: Yes, so it’s very important that there are both quantitative and qualitative measurements that are very actionable and measurable. I’m gonna hold you accountable to make sure that you’re mentoring your team because I want to see progression. Or I expect you to hit this sales number. I expect you to win six Conquest accounts. So, there’s very strong quantitative and qualitative because you don’t want to brutalize your organization. You don’t want to manage by fear. If you don’t do it, you’re out of here, OTD, out the door. So, there had to be a quality of accountability that you convey. Never ask your people to do something you aren’t willing to do. That’s a very important thing is to set the standard, and what I found is the pace you set needs to be the pace you keep, so if you go into an organization the first hundred days then you better be prepared to keep that level of activity that you’ve demonstrated in continuity, in perpetuity for the business, I think.
Betty: Another question, right, Amy?
Amy: Yup, so David Cote on Facebook asks.
Betty: Hi David.
Amy: “What are his best tips for a road warrior doing so much travel to stay fresh and healthy?”
Bob: Is that the Dave Cote at Honeywell?
Betty: No, that’s David Cote at Morgan Stanley, but I know who you’re talking about.
Bob: Hey David, how are you? So, David, you’re asking me a question you know the answer to, I’m sure, but thank you for the question.
Betty: I think it’s affirmation, right?
Bob: Affirmation of what he’s doing. He’s also on the road all the time. So, again, I think there’s the health aspect of that where you just have to be disciplined as you’re traveling and you get in late and you just gotta monitor the amount of food and the type of food you eat. You gotta try to make sure you get some rest because you gotta be fresh, you gotta be sharp, and you really try to plan your trips so you can be most effective on something like that.
Betty: But what does that mean? Do you make sure you take the Red Eye and you can sleep? What does that mean in practice?
Bob: We were all spoiled as CEOs to have a tremendous privilege of having private aviation, and so you’ve heard it a million times, that’s what you miss the most.
Betty: Did you?
Bob: It’s true. It’s true because when your meeting’s done, you go to the plane and you can take off. You don’t have weather delays, you don’t have all of the TSA delays, you don’t have to buy shoes that you don’t have to take off going through the screening process, so it really is–
Betty: It is a luxury.
Bob: It’s a privilege. It’s a tremendous privilege that I certainly respected very much. Today, I do 100% commercial, so it is important to try and make sure the logistics of the flight because that can become pretty stressful when you get delays and you’ve committed to be in meetings and you have to call and reschedule. To me, I just hate, when I make a commitment, I try to really live up to it.
Betty: By the way, not to get off track, but is there a favorite airport you like to fly out of here? Which one do you like the most?
Bob: Here in the north?
Betty: In New York, yeah.
Bob: Well, can you not have a favorite?
Betty: I guess not, right? I guess whichever gets you out fastest.
Bob: I tend to use LaGuardia the most, and of course, on the international, JFK, or if you’re going to the West Coast, you use JFK. The Atlanta airport really has the largest diversity. You could almost get anyplace in the world through Atlanta, one stop.
Betty: That’s true. OK, I interrupted you, sorry, so go on. So, you were saying now that you’re flying commercial, what is your routine like? How do you stay efficient that way then?
Bob: Well, again, I’ll probably get on the road depending if I’ve got an early Monday, Sunday night. Try to get into a hotel in time to get some sleep to be fresh because it’s usually a long week. I generally will travel Monday through Thursday night or Friday. And then when I’m in Atlanta, I’m at the home office most of Saturday, and maybe a few hours on Sunday, running my own business, while I’m doing many other things during the week, looking at other companies, and doing due-diligence, and providing advisory services to some major corporations.
Betty: We have one more question. I wanted to ask you about some of the challenges in your career, Bob, and maybe some of the mistakes you’ve made, or the low points in your career and what you’ve learned from them ’cause I always hear from people that’s when the learned the most. So what would you say was, looking back, a mistake that you made in your career that you learned something from?
Bob: Well listen, if you say you’ve never made a mistake, you’ve never learned anything, right? I could certainly reflect back and at times, I thought I was bending but not breaking the organization, and there was a general opinion at times that maybe I was pushing the organization too fast, too hard, too quick to change the culture or to change the operating system so maybe I should have had a little better sensitivity to that.
Betty: Was this at Home Depot?
Bob: Yeah, at Home Depot. We went from a little over $40 billion to $90 billion in five years. We opened a thousand stores. We open a new store every 48 hours. We almost tripled the income. We grew Home Depot’s supply from zero to eight billion. We grew from zero to a billion eight online. We were blowing and going.
Betty: You were breaking things I’m sure, right? Because you have to.
Bob: I would say not break. I hope I was influencing or encouraging or bending but I just saw the opportunities and wanted to seize them, and I think a lot of the leadership team, we didn’t have, once we got our organization structure in place and populated we didn’t have a lot of turnover. People really bought into “you could do it, we could help.” Having those at GE Power Systems, it was “From wellhead to consumer.” People bought into that. When I was running GE Transportation, it was “Together we can,” and we had probably one of the strongest unions in the country, the IUE, and one of the happiest, and one of the most gratifying is when we have the head of the union come up and say, “We got it. We’re on board. We know what you’re trying to do, you’re going from 300 locomotives a year to 800 locomotives.” It was similar, one of my highlights was when I went to Chrysler. It was interesting day-to-day, an outsider. Not Detroit, not an auto guy, and they said, “Bob, what the heck do you know about the auto industry? “What can you bring to it?” We were going through a rough time, the financial institution melted down, the FICA scores went from 350 to 750. And I said, “Well, auto guys got you here in this problem, “I’m trying to help you.”
Betty: That’s a good point.
Bob: So that was interesting. And the other thing, here’s kind of an interesting thing. I didn’t want to take the position without talking to Ron Gettelfinger, who was the head of the UAW. So, I went down to his headquarters. Fast forward, Ron and I are dear friends, we still talk, tremendous respect for what Ron helped us through.
Betty: But you didn’t know that at the time, when you went down there. Going into enemy territory there.
Bob: Well, I was cautious ‘because I wanted to be respectful and I knew the UAW’s been there longer than I was there, so we walk in the conference room and he brings in a stack of papers like this, and then he brought in a single sheet. I said, “Oh, this is not gonna be good.” He started flipping the paper about stories about the chairman and CEO of GE, and he said, “Jack said this” and “Jack said this” and “Jack said this,” so I was listening and he said, “Now look. I looked you up. Trying to find articles about you.” And he turned over a blank sheet of paper. He said, “You’re good by me.” So we hit it off and he was a tremendous partner through that whole process. We would not have been able to save Chrysler if it wasn’t for Ron and his leadership with the UAW.
Betty: And that trust right from the beginning.
Bob: From the beginning, day one.
Betty: That’s fascinating.
Bob: Very, very important. I’ve been blessed with a lot of highlights and low-lights in my career. I must have made some mistakes. I didn’t get the job at GE.
Betty: How did that feel when that happened, Bob?
Bob: Well, Jack hates for me to say this, but you never train to come in second. When I was growing up in Louisville, I don’t know any trainer who trained their horse to come in second. We’re gonna come in second today. I thought, “Keep your head down, do your job,” and I’ve always thought about that. Focus on what you’re doing, not what you want to do next. So, it was crushing. It was a moment out of Casablanca. It was Thanksgiving. Jack calls and said, “I’m gonna meet you at the FBO.” It was snowing, rainy sleet comes down, and you just knew it wasn’t gonna be a good discussion. But look, he made a decision, and I respect him for that. I love Jack, he’s been a good friend to me, still is. Tremendous regard for him and what he allowed me to do and coach me to do, but I’d be lying if I wasn’t disappointed. So that happened, and within a week, I was running Home Depot.
Betty: But you had no idea that that was gonna happen?
Bob: No, I mean, I’d been a customer of Home Depot, but I never thought I’d be running Home Depot. But it worked out just fine, so I was lucky as heck to be able to go from that to Home Depot and then to Chrysler.
Betty: Well that also, I’m kind of curious when that conversation happened, how did Jack deliver it? Or how did that go? Because I think a lot of people wonder, how do you deliver bad news to people?
Bob: Well, he was on last time telling people how to deliver bad news.
Betty: Yes, he was.
Bob: I saw it.
Betty: I’m curious if that actually happened.
Bob: Vintage Jack. He said, “Listen, I just had to make a tough decision. “I just had to make a gut call, “and all three of you are great “and any one of you could have done it, “and I decided to go with Jeff.” And I appreciate it, he treated me well, so it was heartbreaking for me, and I’m sure a tough call for him, but we handled it in a very professional way and we both moved on and no hard feelings.
Betty: Bob, did you always know that you wanted to be a leader, that you wanted to become a chief executive? Nobody grows up and says, “I want to be a CEO” in the sense of, they’re always like “I want to do this, “I want to do that,” but did you know that you wanted to–
Bob: I’ve run into some that have said that. Right out of college. This is a great story I’ll tell you. I graduated in 1971 and I was going to be a management trainee for Ponderosa Steakhouse. I was going to sell life insurance for Metropolitan Life, and then I got the offer of a lifetime, to start as a manufacturing engineer in 1971 for $9,600. And when I talk to the students in the MBA program, they said, “You mean a week.” I said, “No, for a year.” I went into the two-year manufacturing management trainee program at GE ‘because I wanted to take core curriculum and then localize it to how GE thinks about it. And one of the tasks was write down the number of positions between you and Reg Jones, who was the chairman and CEO. I literally filled, I think, two-and-a-half sheets of paper. Reg Jones, badumbadumbadum, Vice Chairman, and then there was me down here at a level five, they used to have these levels, at $9,600 a year. And I remember telling my wife, we’ve been married now for 45 years, 13 moves later, I said, “Jeez, if I could ever make $100,000 “and be a unit manager.” A unit manager just controls a section of a manufacturing plant, like ran the assembly or ran fabrication. I said, “Man, we will have a ride if I can get there.” As I was successful and really lucky to be able to move up, then it really wasn’t until I came back to GE. I left for a while, I took a little sabbatical and ran CASE Construction Equipment worldwide, and then I was lucky enough to come back, and it was only when I came back. I had to go to purgatory for a while. Jack sent me to Canada. He said, “I can’t reward you for leaving and coming back.” So I went up there for a while, and then he brought me back to run Transportation and then Power Systems, and it was only then that I thought, “Maybe I got a shot at this thing.” I always believed, again, do your job, stay focused on your core, volunteer to do everything you can to broaden your base. A lot of my peers criticize me ’cause I took some jobs that were, I call, “horizontal promotion,” and they said, “Bob, why do you want to run Assembly “from five in the morning ’til nine at night?” “If I don’t do it now, I may never get that experience.” So, I was fortunate to grow a broad base of experience that has served me well looking back now, on how it positioned me, what I learned, not only operationally, but people. We had an assembly line, we were making three refrigerators an hour, 150 people on a deck in Louisville in the summer, it was over 100 degrees. Now, what they don’t teach you is when an employee came up and said, “I can’t work next to that guy, he smells.” That’s not something you learn in the MBA program.
Betty: Those are problems you don’t get taught.
Bob: Don’t get taught that problem. Or when somebody’s supposed to be checking the quality, they’re sitting there reading the paper because they’ve been doing it for 25 years and you confront them, and then you kinda stir the bee pot a little bit, so it’s easy to get people to walk out of a factory; it’s pretty hard to get them back in again. But I’m lucky to have all that scar tissue.
Betty: Oh, we’ve got one question, yes.
Amy: OK, Wojtek Kozak on Facebook asks, “How did the rapid expansion of technology, especially during the past decade, impact the position of a leader?”
Bob: Why, I’ll tell you, it is probably one of the most challenging things a leader has to do today because as I said, in the ’70s, we were dealing with analog.
Betty: Kids these days don’t even know what you’re talking about.
Bob: A dial? What do you mean, a rotary dial phone? We had this panel of millennials and none of them have a hard-line except for the internet. They have a number but I don’t know what the number is.
Betty: We have millennials here; they’re all nodding their heads.
Bob: They’re all smiling.
Betty: They’re all like, “Yup, yup.”
Bob: I think, again, probably one of the biggest challenges. You look at, what is this Pokemon thing that just came out?
Betty: I had to read about it to really understand what it is.
Bob: Well, my grandson’s telling me, he said, “Grandpa, I just got one in the driveway,” or something. “Got what?” And you look at the IPO, right, the new app that’s coming up so again, how do I know about that? You just gotta have your antennae up and listen and try to understand. If you don’t know, find out. Don’t just say, “Well, I don’t know, that’s beyond me.” You have a responsibility to know, to advance yourself. If you want to be out there, you better be prepared to be out there. Technology, to answer the question, is something that you just have to really work at, and you have to recognize that no matter how I work at it, I’m not gonna be as astute as some of the folks in this room today that are running all the technology for us. I learned this at GE, where they had somebody work with us as a mentor, and success was being able to go on Amazon and order a book back then. I remember, we all got excited. Or we got our first Blackberry, and Jack was obsessed with this thing, and being able to text one another across the room. “I’m in the room.” But it’s interesting because I couldn’t do it without reaching out and acknowledging to people, “I need your help, help me understand this. “Give me some tutorial.” And not being intimidated by using the technology. That’s the wonderful part about my six-year-old grandson. He’s not intimidated about anything. He’ll get on and peck around, and he gets it working.
Betty: I know, it’s amazing.
Bob: Show me how you did that. “Oh, grandpa, I don’t know, I just did this and this.” I think the answer to the question, you just gotta immerse yourself, as I said earlier, in this, and figure out what works, how it works, and what’s relevant for you on how you can apply it.
Betty: I run into that too, I think, where my first reaction is resistance, “Oh no no, I’ve always done it this way.” But you do have to adapt right away. You have to say.
Bob: And the one good thing about it is if you make a mistake, it’s not life threatening. You may be embarrassed you sent something out you didn’t want sent out, but give it a shot, figure out. It’s not that difficult.
Betty: That’s absolutely right. Are we running out of time? OK, so our producer is saying we’ve run out of time, but thank you so much guys for all these questions. Actually though, before I go, because we did tease this, so I do want to ask you this last question. Donald Trump.
Betty: You like him as a leader of this free world. Why?
Bob: I like Donald Trump for the following reasons. One, I think he will bring back to the administration support and a knowledge of business, which has been absent for eight years. I think he will be very sensitive to policies and guidelines that have been detrimental to the growth of business. I think he’ll be very sensitive to the need to have a GDP, the administration starts every year at 3.5, right now, some of the banks are at 1.8, heading south. So, every year we start up, and then they back down. And, a lot of people talk about jobs, but you can’t have jobs without a GDP. Now, is he, like any of us, none of us are fully competent in every area, so, hopefully, we’ll know a little bit more tomorrow at eleven. I think he’s astute enough to surround himself, as he’s done in his own business, with very smart men and women of diversity, with inclusion, to help him, whether it’s the Department of Defense, whether it’s the Department of Commerce.
Betty: But even though his campaign has been pretty divisive so far?
Bob: It’s unfortunate. We all have our detractors, and we all have things that we say maybe we shouldn’t have said. But listen, he is what he is. He’s said that. He doesn’t apologize for it. It’s been offensive to various people along the way, but I think on balance, we need to get back to being a world leader in our economy, in our economics, and as I look at the two candidates, I just think he brings that acumen to the office. Now, it’s a very tight race, and the popularity is pretty close. They both have their detractors of who trusts who, who doesn’t trust who, who’s popular, and so we’ll see. I think it’s gonna be, this is gonna be one for the animals. I don’t think I’ve seen one like this since I started to vote.
Betty: So, have you spoken with Trump? Are you in contact with his campaign?
Bob: No, with the campaign, yes, but Donald, no.
Betty: I’m just curious. Would you be interested in any position? I’m just curious if there was something in his cabinet.
Bob: I would be happy to help Donald any way I could short of going through congressional hearings. Been there, done that.
Betty: It’s torture, right?
Bob: Torturous. I think I could be more productive helping than going through six months of open kimono, going back in history.
Betty: Look, you were a company CEO, you don’t need anymore.
Bob: Been there.
Betty: Right, I was gonna say.
Bob: I’ve been under the microscope with the jaunts aside many times. Many times, Betty.
Betty: Bob, thank you so much.
Bob: Thank you.
Betty: We really, really appreciate you doing this interview.
Bob: I hope it was great. Thanks for allowing me to do this.
Betty: It was fantastic. All right, thank you guys. Great. Now we’re off. Bob, that was fantastic. I’m so glad.